Do you ever think about guys who, when they started out for the Mets, you watched them and thought to yourself:
“Now, THIS GUY could make the Hall of Fame someday?”
And then they didn’t.
Because it takes a whole lot of quantity to go with superior quality.
Let’s rattle off some guys I wrongly thought early on might make it:
Jerry Koosman - wins 36 games over his first two seasons. Long career, 222 career wins, but lousy offensive support throughout his career, so no HOF.
Rusty Staub - on base over 4,000 times, 1,466 RBIs, 6 time All Star. Not enough very high quality, even if there was a lot of very laudable quality.
Darryl Strawberry - dubbed the black Ted Williams early on, he had several great seasons and a larger-than-life persona, but too few such seasons. Nope.
Dwight Gooden - best pitcher through age 21 in baseball history, hands down, going 58-19...but like Darryl, did not stay great long enough. Hard to fathom.
David Cone - 20-3 in his first season as a Met, a Cy Young award, 194-126 career...perfect game ( no, not as a Met), fanned 19 in a game once, nearly 2,700 Ks...close, in mind, but not close at all in the writers’ minds, and hence no cigar.
Jose Reyes - base stealer extraordinare, batting title, but injured too much. Nope. Not even close.
David Wright - looked like a real possibility early, but then the Wilpons put him in the hitters’ graveyard known as Citifield and then his back betrayed him. Everyone loves him, but love and his truncated career #’s won’t get him there.
Vince Coleman stole 99 bases in 235 Mets games. Before the Mets, he stole an astonishing 326 out of 387 tries in his first 3 seasons with the Cardinals, and an average of 75 per year in seasons 4-6. He ended up with an amazing 752 career steals, but only swiped 12 after age 33. Not long enough, and somehow only scored 849 career runs.
John Olerud - hit .354 or better twice, and had 500 doubles, 255 HRs, over 1,200 RBIs, and a dazzling .398 career OBP...but not sensational enough. Sorry.
Carlos Delgado - 473 HRs, 1,512 RBIs. And not even close to making the HOF. Puzzler.
Billy Wagner - a great, fireballing lefty reliever - but it seems some think he did not pitch long enough. 853 games, 903 innings, 1,196 Ks, 2.31 ERA, 47 wins, 422 saves, WHIP of 0.99. I sure think he 100% deserves it, but I don’t get to vote. He is still nowhere near to the required 75% of the vote. Cuckoo.
Matt Harvey - man, for a short while, he pitched like a Hall of Famer, but injuries killed him far, far short of any possible HOF consideration.
Carlos Beltran might make it once he is eligible, but the sign stealing scandal that suddenly paled in importance to COVID might keep him out of the venerated Hall.
Current players who are future HOF possibilities:
Jake deGrom and Pete Alonso...and if COVID gets the heck out of here, maybe even Jeff McNeil.
But getting there, as can be seen above, sure ain’t easy.
Then there's a little lefty who went 90-87 with a 2.89 ERA for his career with 424 Saves and never got a sniff at Cooperstown...probably didn't want him tomato farming there.
ReplyDeleteYou must be referring to Generalissimo Franco - he was very good, but not, for me, on the level of a Billy Wagner. I did forget Johnny went 21 seasons.
ReplyDeleteMy brother Steve once got into a short, tense conversation with Franco in one of Shea's restrooms LOL. Two kids from Brooklyn and Queens.
Franco was a 5th round pick for the Dodgers - a fine time for the Mets to not go aggressive in drafting the hometown kid.
Tom
ReplyDeleteI know you are having push back from 'Jimmy' on your posts but I for one think they add much to the site.
Keep it up buddy.
And Jimmy... could you please take the time to log back in with your real name rather than an anon post?
I hear you, Mack. Comments are welcome, and understanding the tone of the writer is important as well.
ReplyDeleteToday, in an article I did on the site BEFORE yesterday's posted, I wrote this:
Current (Mets) players who are future HOF possibilities: Jake deGrom and Pete Alonso.
So I very much respect deGrom.
I love Hall of Fame discussions .. I agree with you about Billy Wagner.
ReplyDeleteAs far as the future possibilities, Jake has some work to do - he needs at least 4 more years with 6+ WAR and probably a couple more Cy Young awards to offset the crazy low number of wins. If he has 4 more seasons like 2019 with 8.2 WAR he'll have almost 75 for his career and if his win totals also match, he'll have around 110 career wins when 300 used to be the baseline. I understand times are changed and there is a guy named Koufax that only has 165 wins with less than 50 WAR, but I think he falls short unless he can score 5 Cy Youngs.
With all that said, I think there needs to be another wing to the HOF (or a separate institution) to recognize the outstanding players that fall just short. Carlos DalGado, Vada Pinson, etc on the offense, Tommy John, Jim Kaat, etc for pitchers would make 4 good starters.
I think it is premature to talk about Pete yet, although if he keeps things up the way he started, he could get there. His drawback is his age - already 25 (will be in June) - most of the great ones had much beefier stats by their 25th birthday.
I cannot see a path for McNeil. The math says he has to average over 230 hits per year for the next 12 years to get to 300 by age 40. And even then, his residual numbers won't help him much (Homers talk, he can't get there on homers). I cannot see him getting any MVP awards. A good solid ballplayer, but not HOF.
Remember 1969, just so many players who, due to injury shortened careers or starting too late or just being really good but not quite great, just don’t make it.
ReplyDeleteThat’s why almost everyone had to be thinking Dwight would make the Hall when he was a dominant 58-19 before he turned 22. And even he fell short. IT IS SO HARD TO GET INTO THE HALL.