So the lockout charade must soon end. Because pretty soon, with a persisting lockout, season games could be cancelled, and if they wait long enough, they won't be made up.
Cash flows squeezed - franchise values deflated - unacceptable - get those trucks off the bridge and settle this thing so we can play ball and keep the cash infusing and the franchise values inflating as if they were gas prices.
Once it does settle, though, as all such silly things do, the Mets, like many teams, will have to finish their off-season roster enhancement restructuring.
So, here's your challenge, Mr. and Mrs. Macks Mets Reader:
How would you finish off the sculpting of the 2022 masterpiece begun pre-lockout when the Cohen regime acquired the likes of Scherzer and Marte et al?
Only answer if you seriously want to build a true pennant contender. If all you intend to do is build a team capable of serious September baseball, you're being too "Wilpon".
OK - the ground rules have been laid out - your task lies before you - let's hear it.
But, before you do...
One of our most incisive commentators on this site has suggested trading Big Pete Alonso for a couple of top, young starter arms. Big Pete would still be cheap for an acquiring team for years to come, and would give them instant box office.
Before quickly discarding such an idea, did you know who had the highest single season slugging % in Mets' history? 1B Dom Smith, in not-so-long-ago 2020, when he put up a .616. I hear he is also a deft gloveman at 1B.
Thoughts on that, if you care to share??
21 comments:
Have at it, folks - I'm headed to church.
I read that there are 66 Mets minor leaguers in Port St. Lucie who are not on the 40-man roster and can begin spring training. The thing is, I have 182
Mets minor leaguers on my list (not even counting DSL Mets). So where are the rest of them. Even Wikipedia lists 157 Mets minor leaguers on their 5 minor league teams as of 2/3/22. I know some are still injured or rehabbing at home from 2021 but still. Can anyone explain this?
Nickel, my only guess is low A St Lucie season starts 3 days later than Syracuse; did not want to be inundated with minor leaguers all at once; and I am not sure when FCL season starts.
I'd be surprised if a lot more don't show up in the next few days. Probably some "pecking order" time lags involved.
Yeah, it makes sense that the short-season players would not be at Port St. Lucie
at this point.
Trade Pete? Uh, no. Right now, Alonso is the only power hitter on the Mets. Pillar, Villar and Conforto are all gone. They need another power bat, not trade the only power bat they have.
Bob W.
Trade Pete, the only clutch hitter on the team, the only hitter on the team. Trade for a hitter to bat behind Big Pete.
If the lockout cuts into the season the fans need to answer.obviously us diehards aren’t going quit the game. But how about a nationwide boycott of Opening Days games. Half empty stadiums would send a message to both own Wes and players.
Woody, I like that!
To my friends here that lament the loss of our big bopper, how else do you expect to get two good young pitchers other than give something up? And, what is the big loss anyway when you have JD Davis, Smith, Vientos and Baty behind them… Alonso is very expendable and there’s an old saying: Better to trade a player a year early than a year late.
Alonso is a good player, so that’s why you’re getting two good young pitchers. My example in the other article was trading Mazzillis for Darling and Terrell. Then, they used Terrell to get HoJo. Not bad… So, if you can do that again, why would you not when you have replacements?
I did drift back after all to take a look.
Gus brings up a great point. What about Vientos?
Vientos hit an astounding 21 HRs in his last 200 at bats in AA and AAA last season, at the age of 21. He hit over .300 in that stretch.
Pete was 21 1/2 when he started his MINOR league career in rookie ball.
Is it possible that Vientos might become a BETTER player, and hitter, than Pete? And that it might happen very soon?
For some reason, Vientos ranks down in baseball's top 100 - so I again pose the question - which hitter above him had 21 HRs in 200 at bats in 2021? I am certain the answer is "none". I think baseball is missing it.
Woody, good stuff. Just don't sit out the games in an 18 wheeler. Authorites don't take kindly to those protesters.
Nickel, I looked back and it appears the FCL team played just 54 games in 2021. Starting I'm sure a few weeks after the draft.
I think that stinks for guys drafted who played there last year and are re-assigned there this year. But I'm sure that as minor leaguers get hurt, the best of the FCL guys will get promoted to the full season clubs, so even though no official games for a few months, they still want to develop and impress.
agree, thanx, Tom
I have been out of pocket most of the day, but didn't want to be left out of this discussion.
hmm, trading Alonso. I don't disagree with Gus on this topic and if they could get both McKenzie and Civale from Cleveland I'd be ok with it. Anything less that that level of return, no thanks. There are not many teams that could provide it, and the with the value of young pitching, I don't see a second coming of Mazilli for Darling and Terrell happening.
There are two flip sides, one already mentioned in the comments that Alonso is the only real power bat in the line-up. The second is that he is at this point the 'heart and soul' of the franchise. He is still on the front side of his career and is in many ways the face of the Mets. Lindor may get there, but Alonso is the guy now. I do not know if it makes any sense to trade him and lose the goodwill he brings.
A couple other random thoughts pertaining to the question Tom asked. I also am not quite sure about the Canha signing. I think perhaps that Canha and McNeil together could yield a good get in a trade as well. It seems like they do need to do some roster cleanup to balance it a bit. I have not yet settled in my mind who I would like to see playing second base (yeah, I did, but Baez is gone). I don't like either Cano or McNeil as the regular, and it seems like Escobar is more likely to be at third.
I do think they need to get another 2nd or 3rd order pitcher. I like Luis Castillo or Sean Manaea, altho Manaea has only one year left before free agency, and I'm not a fan of trading up-side players with multiple years of control for a one year guy. Perhaps Canha would interest Oakland again? And toss in a mid range prospect (or even Nick Plummer and a lower minors pitcher)
They do need to secure another lefty or two for the bullpen. Chasen Shreve is my pick, although Tony Watson will do. Both would be even better.
69, when the Mets got Darling and Terrell, Darling was in the minors while Terrell was MLB ready. I actually like KC’s stockpile better, but it’s hard to expect two MLB ready arms like those you want from Cleveland.
Good bandying about, Gus and R 69.
My brother said he saw Manaea dominate the Yankees and called him a beast. So I know who he wants. He seemed happy to give up Ginn and McNeil - I cautioned him about Ginn, who could be...the next Ron Darling.
Gus .. i hear ya, but with Alonso an established slugger that has won the All Start Festivities Home Run Derby twice, I think they gotta get back that kind of talent.
Seriously though, they really cannot trade him for a minor league 'promise'. While Darling was a first round draft pick, his only year in the Rangers organization produced a 4-2 record with a 4.44 ERA in AA. It would be hard to see Pete go for a guy like that.
Yeah, Manaea has only 2022 control left. There is no way I include Ginn in a trade for him. I would actually be reluctant to trade any of McNeil, Smith, or Davis with the control they have left at this point, although that may be a risk they have to take. But no top 10 prospects, especially pitchers.
Especially after reading this about Matt Allan (from Yahoo Sports):
There was, and still is, a chance Allan could pitch in the 2022 season, But he did have a setback in January where he had to get a nerve moved - he is, however, slated to start throwing again in early March.
Allan said his elbow was a bit of a ticking timebomb - he had been pitching with a partially torn UCL since he was "15 or 16."
SO....the Mets must have known that he had a partially torn UCL in high school, but drafted him anyway. I think if they were smart, once the pandemic started, he should have joined Ginn and Thor and gotten the surgery done in spring 2020, since that year was going to be lost to minor leaguers.
He could have gotten lucky like Lugo and pitched for years with the partial tear, but if you're losing a year anyway....
Now, he likely won't pitch for the Mets until mid-2024, is my guess. Maybe 2025. That sounds so far away.
The Tigers and Royals are first and second in starting pitching talent, in an article I saw last month. The Mariners have some good ones, but not as much. The Rays… well, they’re the Rays. Overall, if a team can part with two high upside upper minors arms, we can talk. If not, not a chance.
On Manea, a guy with one year control? Don Smith is the best MLB player I’d offer, or a couple of pitching prospects like Askew and Ventura. I don’t see why the Mets need to use prospects when free agents are available.
I like Gus idea of trading Alonso if you can get two talented arms for him. If memory serves me correctly, wasn't Dominic Smith a clutch hitter at triple A?. Lets also not forget that we're adding another bat through the DH.
Uhmm, lets see, a couple of great international signings, two high upside arms for Pete and six top 100 picks on the draft.
2023 team can feature Smith or Vientos at 1B, Mauricio at 2B, Lindor SS, Batty 3B, Alvarez C.
Rotation can potentially include one or two of the arms we get from the Pete trade + Allan + JT Ginn anchored by deGrom and Scherzer.
I wouldn't cry in such scenario.
Viper, who has the single season highest Mets' slugging %? Dom Smith in 2020. Now, that could have been a bizarre short year fluke, but highest ever? I'd not quickly dismiss that. If he could give us .500 in 2022, with a real glove, and we got 2 functional high upside pitchers...why not?
And like I've posted, in the high minors in 2021, Vientos hit 21 HRs in his last 200 at bats in AA and AAA. At that age, Pete was just turning pro in rookie ball. For the life of me, I do not know why Vientos is not more highly regarded.
I got him the line up for 2023, and see no reason he can get a few hundred Mets ABs in 2022.
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