1/6/13

Jordany Valdespin, Lucas Duda, Sandy Alderson, 2013, War Room, Sponsors

19 comments


39 Days until Pitchers and Catchers Report


C Anthony Recker is going to report to camp late next week… hope the gate is open.


Houston announced that Vince Coleman will be an outfield/baserunning developmental specialist assigned to Class A Quad Cities.


Playoff Baseball:

RP Randy Fontanez - Indios de Mayaguez – 1.1-IP, 0-R, 2-SV, 0.00

C Francisco Pena - Aguilas Cibaenas – 0-5, 1-R, 1-K, .000

RF Jordany Valdespin - Leones del Escogido – 2-5, .444

                Did you notice that Valdespin isn’t even mentioned in the formation of the Mets 2013 outfield? Vada Pinson could probably be dragged out to RF and make the team right now, but no ‘Spin’. Sounds like another year in AAA for the trouble child to get his act together.

Lucas Duda told ESPNNewYork.com the wrist "feels great."

                What the hell do you think he’s going to say? ‘No, it feels like shit so I don’t know if I’m going to be able to play in the worst outfield being formed in the game of baseball.’


Jeff Passan  wrote something about Sandy Alderson that all of us need to keep reminding ourselves as we piss and moan about the off-season:

“The masterwork that was Sandy Alderson's handling of the R.A. Dickey trade this offseason should be studied, dissected and, whenever possible, emulated. He turned a 38-year-old pitcher on a one-year contract into six years of the game's best catching prospect, six years of a frontline pitching prospect, a high-ceiling 18-year-old and a stopgap catcher. And when your owner needs a tourniquet to stop hemorrhaging money, this is the sort of deal a general manager must concoct to keep hope afloat and progress alive.”


Nice things continue to be written about C Travis d’Arnaud:

“Once the Mets had acquire d’Arnaud their fate behind the plate suddenly appeared much different. d’Arnaud is one of the rare catching prospects that scouts feel can do it all, but like Romine he saw his 2012 season cut short due to injury. He batted .333/.380/.595 this past season at Triple-A, over 303 plate appearances, before suffering a season ending knee injury. Had it not been for the injury there are some that believe he may have made his MLB Debut late this past summer with the Blue Jays. Like Romine, however, it appears as though the Mets are planning to start him back in the minor leagues at the beginning of the 2013 season, as ESPNNewYork.com’s Adam Rubin suggests, with the team’s catching duties being shared by John Buck and Anthony Recker initially.” - S2S

-boy, this was a great trade…


Lastly… it seems to me that the refinancing of the Mets may have had bad timing. Sure, there are some players still out there worth pursuing; however, I’m as big a draft guy as Sandy Alderson is and I don’t want a draft pick lost either. I think the 2014 free agent market will define this team… examples that are put there are OFs David Murphy, Coco Crisp, Rajai Davis, Jacoby Ellsbury, Curtis Granderson, Chris Young, Shin-Soo Choo, and David DeJesus.


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Any desire to continue an open discussion a la ‘The War Room’? Just start it off on this post.

19 comments:

Charles said...

Yes, I do.

Does anyone really believe that the Wiloons will use the 150+mill they just recieved to actually start signings free agents now, or was it to help cover the teams futures loses?

Or, was it to buy more helicopters and silver spoons for future Wilpons?

Mack Ade said...

I don't think the timeline on the refinancing and the free agent market had anything in common...

bankers don't care about outfields

the fact is that real estate in Manhattan is booming right now and the Wilpon's porfolio is a great guarantee on a refinancing, especially SNY

(BTW... my wife looked up our old apartment... The Buchanan on 48th and Lexington... where we paid $335 per month in 1971... it's now $5000 per month)

Howard Schmidt said...

The phillies are trying to compete with the mets for worst outfield: Darin Ruf, Ben Revere, Domonic Brown.

Charles said...

Brown has upside and was once a top prospect. A guy they thought so high of that they wouldn't give him up for Beltran at the time.

I bet the Phillies wish they still had Pence. I hope they got something real nice for him because that deal made zero sense for a team looking to continue competing the next year.

Yeah, I keep reading that this strengthens the Wilpons chances of keeping the team and building a contender. I think it's true, but I still think the plan remains the same: wait out 2013 and open the wallets next year.

I hope this helps them have a great draft and possibly some real good international signings. I'll wait out another bad season. I just want their system to be so good in two years that they won't have any chance of losing for at lest 10 years. It's our turn.

Michi L. said...

I hope we just have to wait one more season. Sandy isnt overwhelmed by the Outfielders of the FA market and i think its the right decision to not overpay a guy like Hairston! Yes he was awesome last season but i doubt he can duplicate it.
And to give up the 11th pick of the Draft for Bourn..mh feels strange!
I hope our top prospects get some time this year at Citifield and then next year when they got a little taste plus a nice free agent we are hopefully fight for a wildcard.
But with the new money maybe we can sign a realy nice reliver!? Like Wilson!? I think this makes sense

enyherb said...

Re: Valdespin - Mack, he's not an outfielder, so I, for one, would be happy that he gets no mention in the Mets outfield. He looks very awkward out there, often taking a step or two in before turning and racing back to make a catch. He has good instincts, so perhaps with more innings out there in AAA he will take better routes, avoid getting turned around, and get better jumps. Oh, and btw, he is still listed as the #5 outfielder on the Mets depth chart, as Duda's backup in LF.

Meanwhile, I think his best future with the Mets should be at 2B. I think Alderson has a lot of love for Murphy, so he might not want to trade him. If he used Murphy to acquire an outfielder or starter, I could see Spin stepping in at second. Later in the season, he could share 2B with Flores (if he is still around) with the better man eventually emerging as the regular.

Re Refinancing: Although, as you point out, the timing was inopportune for the Mets, it nonetheless offers some opportunities that we didn't have before they got the cash. A 2 year deal with Hairston at $8+ million might be more palateable, Crisp's $7 million for 2013 might be more acceptable, hell, even Ellsbury's projected $8.1 million might not be an impediment.

It should also allow them to be a little more relaxed about pursuing starters like Marcum or Saunders and relievers like Wilson, Capps, Lindstrom or Atcheson. And maybe he'll resign Cedeno, rather than rely on Quintanilla for the utility infielder role.

Charles said...

If I'm them, I use any money I'm willing to spend for this season on the bullpen. I think, with their starters, having a shut down bullpen will easily add 10 wins to the season. If they have a top 7 rotation in the NL, which I think they have, that bullpen should make them at least what they were last year.

I wish I knew what they were thinking. If I knew they were definately going for it new year, I'd say go into this season as is. I'd hope that Santana did great and I'd trade him in July to try to get a good prospect. I'd do the same with Murphy. I'd play Flores exclusively at second in Vegas and have him ready for the all star break.

I think that they need to go into this season completely willing to rack up loses and obtain prospects from whatever assets they're willing to trade off to get good prospects for next season. Who knows, maybe in July after Santana and Murph hopefully show they're having good seasons, they could be packaged together to a contender for a top 25-50 MLB outfield prospect.

Of course, this all hinges on wether they actually do nothing else this off season. Time is wasting away, but the RA trade showed that Sandy is willing to wait for a great deal and I really can't wait got spring to roll around.

Michi L. said...

Totally agree

Mack Ade said...

I'm with Charles regarding not trading the building blocks to the future.

Wright, Tejada, Davis, d'Arnaud, Harvey, Wheeler, Niese, Synder, Montero, Edgin, Parnell, Gee,
are the future of this team.

That's 12 guys... need 13 more...


Mack Ade said...

Howard:

Welcome...

I haven't read anything but are they trying to sign another outfielder also?

David Rubin said...

Mack- I get the feeling that, if the Mets are going to use any of that money for player, it will be in a Dodger-like move to absorb a salary in June, July or August from a team desperate to shed payroll. I'm NOT saying that they'd do ANYTHING at the same LEVEL as the Dodgers did (so no one jump down my throat and think I am saying the long-frugal Mets' are suddenly the Guggenheim Group OR are ready to take on $250+ mil in obligations)- but you KNOW that there WILL be a team that's out of contention with $$ to shed and in search of long-term pitching prospects, which the Mets have an abundance of, and Sandy can then utilize funds (I pray) to grab them at that time...at LEAST it spices up the season a bit...

Mack Ade said...

David:

I agree... and I also think this is how they will rid themselves of the Johan Santana contract... around the all-star break... for a 'sign-and-trade' deal for one of the scheduled 2014 FA outfielders.

Charles said...

By July, when the team is about 15 games under .500, I really doubt they'll be making any deals to ADD payroll.

That's usually when teams try to cut payroll and get something in return. So I agree they'll have their fingers crossed that Santana pitches like he did the first two months of last season so they can deal him. I just can't see Alderson making deals to strengthen the team when they're already out of it.

I think at that point they'll just work on keeping the core players for 2014 and bringing in whoever they can that'll help, prospect wise, in a trade or two.

I can see the Dodgers grabbing Santana at that point if they haven't run away with the division by then.

David Rubin said...

Charles, since Sandy is building "long-term" if a player becomes available late in the season who is signed for enough years to fill a key position for the team while they are becoming competitive again (2014 and beyond, hopefully), of course Sandy is going to make that move regardless as to whether or not they are in contention for that year. Not all moves are made to simply make it to the play-offs that season, as you know; if you look at a ton of late-season deals, they are often made just as much for the future as they are for that moment. Knowing that there are not going to be a lot of "top level" free agents available in 2014 (far more the following season), if a "Hanley Ramirez-type" is going to become available to the Mets, I think regardless of where they sit at the time, if Sandy can snag the player for the right price in prospects and salary, he makes the move. I liken him to a predator (in a good way) - he works at his own pace, is beyond patient, and is ready to pounce on something when the deal is going to truly favor him (or, in this case, by extension, the Mets).

Mack Ade said...

Charles and David:

I'm writing on this in the morning.

This will also become the time that certain people make 'unofficial' telephone calls to agents of players scheduled to become free agents in the following off-season, in hopes of arranging for a verbal okay to begin the 'sign-and-trade' process to make the deal worth while.

But...

the worst thing that could happen is a duplication of a Zack Wheeler type prospect for Santana.

enyherb said...

We're talking two completely different types of trades here, and it would be very unusual for a team to engage in both types at the same time. Usually a team is either a buyer or a seller. I find it hard to envision trading Santana for a Jackie Bradley, say, and then turning around and giving up a bunch of prospects for a David Murphy or Hunter Pence in a sign and trade deal.

Personally, I see the Mets unloading Santana at the deadline, and hopefully Frankie Francisco, and maybe even Scott Hairston, who I still fully expect to see in a Mets uniform when I am down in St. Lucie come February. Then look for them to be moderately active in the 2014 free agent market to fill in the holes.

John Skrynecki said...

I may be in the minority here, but I think the Mets need give Valdespin a legit chance to play in the outfield this spring. He might be the most athletically gifted person on the 40 man roster. He is raw defensively but he isn't a shortstop either. He is fast, has pop, and has speed too. If he could harness those tools into a semi refined approach, it could be a very exciting combination.

Regarding the Johan trade, I think the Mets should do anything in their power to get a legit prospect for Johan. It does not need to be a top 10 prospect like Wheeler, but just adding someone who could contribute long term to the team would be great.

If someone becomes available via a trade, the Mets should only do it if he is young and able to contribute for a long time. David Murphy is not the answer. While Hunter Pence would be great in Queens, he will be 30 by the end of the year and not worth the prospects.

The Mets should stay the course, build through the draft and shrewd trades and aim for 2014-2015 and not take any shortcuts

enyherb said...

John, I don't disagree with you on Valdespin. I don't want to see him patrolling the expanse of CF at Citifield in April. But as I said in a previous post, if he can work out the kinks in Vegas and displays a better feel for the outfield, I have no problem with giving him a shot there.

I also agree wholeheartedly about trading Santana. If he gets off to a good start, a contending team will snap him up in July and give us a high level prospect.

And I only mentioned David Murphy and Hunter Pence as possible trade targets because I know Mack likes them. (Don't get me wrong, Mack, I like them too. But neither would be my top trade target now. Either could be a free agent target next year, though, especially if Pence snaps back to his 2011 form in his walk year this season.)

Mack Ade said...

John, I have watched Spin play for a year...

and, I think he's the top athlete on the team...

but he's still a thug and doesn't fit in the clubhouse - big problem when this happens with this team

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