1/13/18

Reese Kaplan -- Ranking Mets Managers since 1962


When Mickey Callaway signed on to be the New York Mets’ 21st manager for what will be the team’s 56th season, he joins a rag-tag assortment of characters who have shepherded the team to an overall losing .480 record since its inception.  There have been a few highlights for sure, but there have been more lowlights.  Let’s see if we can figure out how to rank the various Mets managers.


Clearly the number one choice has to be Davey Johnson.  He not only sported the highest winning percentage by a very wide margin, but he was able to deliver his 595 in just over 1000 games at the helm.  He was there to lead the Mets to their last World Series victory and was able to trust younger ballplayers enough to take the field on a nightly basis. 


Beginning with subsequent rankings there will surely be debate.  Bobby Valentine was always a fan favorite and he enjoyed some good success with the club, though many would suggest he underachieved given the talent he had on the roster.  His performance from 1996 to 2002 included just two playoff appearances and a loss in the 2000 World Series to the New York Yankees.  He did that while having what was often considered the best infield ever with John Olerud, Edgardo Alfonzo, Rey Ordonez and Robin Ventura.


Oddly, Willie Randolph, who though he got a raw deal in how he was fired, actually had the second best record in club history based upon winning percentage.  In his tenure from 2005 to 2008 he had solid ballclubs that included such players as youngsters David Wright and Jose Reyes, as well as the last year of Mike Piazza, the Carlos Delgado years, Carlos Beltran and Cliff Floyd.  In the rotation he had guys like Pedro Martinez, Tom Glavine, Anna Benson’s husband, John Maine and Steve Trachsel.  It’s not exactly All Star material after the first two, but it’s not chopped liver either.  Most people felt he was in over his head and despite the positive outcome we all remember vividly the west coast midnight massacre that ensued.


You could certainly argue that Gil Hodges deserved the third spot (or even the second) but that’s more for having brought the Mets from perennial punchline to World Champions in 1969.  His success was not as great as foggy memories would have you think having made it to the post season just one time during his 1968 to 1971 tenure, but his premature death left people wondering what might have been.


Another guy who seemed in over his head from day one was fan favorite (as a player) Bud Harrelson.  He has spunk and actually delivered a winning record during his short stay with the lineup pencil.  In 1990 and 1991 he delivered a combined .529 winning percentage but was fired by the front office because back then they actually wanted to win and he never brought them to the post season.  Considering that his 1991 club had a rotation including David Cone, Doc Gooden, Frank Viola, Ron Darling and Wally Whitehurst, perhaps that perception of underachieving was somewhat justified. 


Willie Randolph’s former coach who became derisively nicknamed “The Jokester”, Jerry Manuel, took over for him but was not as good.  He lost the division lead in 2008 when the Phillies clinched in late September following a historic collapse, yet in very Wilpon fashion he was brought back where he lasted for two undistinguished seasons.  Still, his .488 winning percentage was better than most of the others who have held the reins.

The next three can probably go in any sequence – Yogi Berra, Casey Stengel and Joe Torre.  The first two are here for what they did for the fanbase more so than what they accomplished on the field.  They helped create or solidify an identity for Mets fans.  Joe Torre is here not for what he accomplished as a manager of the Mets given his roster of Alex Trevino, Lee Mazzilli, Doug Flynn, Frank Taveras, Elliott Maddox, Steve Henderson, Jerry Morales and Joel Youngblood.  Considering he was in his first managerial gig with such lackluster talent that he was able to achieve 67 wins is pretty remarkable.  He went onto have a Hall of Fame managerial career. 


Finishing up at the bottom of the top 10 is recently deposed leader Terry Collins.  Enough has been written about his penchant for veterans over youth, his bullpen mismanagement and his poor skills as a communicator.  He was a loser in 5 of the 7 long, painful years he controlled the lineup pencil, finishing with a negative winning percentage of .486 despite having some All Star talent at his disposal.  Players who left flourished, including Justin Turner, Daniel Murphy and Angel Pagan.  Even Chris Young who couldn’t buy a hit under his leadership went on to hit 33 HRs and 101 RBIs in just over a combined season’s worth of ABs.  Each club he’s managed in the past in Houston and Anaheim went onto sustained success upon his departure.  Hopefully that pattern repeats with Mickey Callaway.  However, to give the devil his due, he did make two post seasons and one World Series in the only 2 winning seasons he managed to have.  Some people have a soft spot for that achievement and it can’t be taken away from the man.  Furthermore, the fact they kept renewing his contract was testament to the fact that the club did not value winning.  The sad fact is, however, as bad as he was as a manager, he still belongs in the Mets top 10. 

There are 10 more who were worse, including Dallas Green, Art Howe, Jeff Torborg, Joe Frazier, George Bamberger and Wes Westrum, as well as others who held the job short term on an interim basis.

How would you rank them? 

12 comments:

Tom Brennan said...

Casey was # 1. Ten pennants and 7 World Series wins in 12 years, 1149-696. Oh, sorry, that was the Yankees timeframe.

Mets? 175-404, .304. I guess not having Mickey and Whitey didn't help. Davey sure had talent, though.

I definitely had Terry Collins ahead of Art Howe. Just sayin'.

Mack Ade said...

Hey Tom... too many Yankees references here...

I can't help but vote for my childhood hero.

Big #14.

Reese Kaplan said...

I had Terry smack in the middle of the pack -- number 10 of 20.

bill metsiac said...

For those who believe that the record of the team is more about the manager than the players, I have just one question - - - how did the genius who won all those games with the Yankees suddenly become so brain dead when he took over in Flushing?

Tom Brennan said...

Gil was actually my favorite. Casey my sentimental favorite.

Reese, 10 below Terry? Wow.

Mike Freire said...

I vote for Davey...........stupidity in the front office and with ownership short circuited a mini-dynasty, IMO. Their run of success should have been longer.........the Mike Scioscia home run in Game 4 seemed like the beginning of the end for the series and the Mets in general.

bill metsiac said...

Do people here really believe that the quality of the mgr overrules the quality of the talent?

Was the Stengel of 5 straight WSs in the Bronx miles better than his doppelganger who had the worst w/l % of any Mets mgr? Did the Joe Torre who had such an awful record managing the Mets suddenly become a genius once he crossed the river?

I confess to not knowing the intricacies of managing, but I judge a mgr on team performance vs expectations. If the "consensus" of the media picked a team to make the post-season, and the team stays relatively healthy, IMO the mgr bears someresponsibility.

In '16,we met the Giants in the WC game. In '17,we were crippled with injuries and finished close to the bottom of the league. But they, without as many injuries, had the WORST RECORD IN MLB! Does thay mean Boche is a worse mgr than Terry? I guess this shows that my criteria don't meet the test either.

Tom Brennan said...

Bill, superior talent is a key correlation coefficient - or something like that.

The losses of Matz, Wheeler, Thor, Harvey, Cespedes, Lagares, Walker and Familia for extended periods, plus the fire sale of veterans, were the key contributors to turning what could have been a 90+ win season into a 70 win season - with Collins.

The decimated team at season's end would have been challenged to beat the 1962 Mets.

bill metsiac said...

Exactly, Tom. If mgrs are judged by their w/l records, why were Girardi and Baker both let go after reaching the P-S? Girardi achieved that with a team that wasn't expected to win anywhere near as many as they did. And before the Yankees, he managed the 4th place Marlins to a 78-84 record and was the NL MOTY!!!

Judging a mgr based on w/l, without regard to the talent of the players is IMO ridiculous.

Mike Freire said...

Clearly, the quality of the roster is the primary factor in a team's success. For example, if you take Tom Brady away from the Patriots, do you think Bill Belicheck is still viewed as one of the best of all time?

However, I also think a manager can either elevate or suppress the talent on hand, to an extent (i.e. over or underachieve).

I didn't care for Terry as a manager, starting with his use of his pitchers (heavy emphasis on the bullpen). That, plus his career record (long enough to draw some conclusions), was average, at best (a bit below .500)

I don't think he was principally at fault last year, injuries were. But, TC's message and tactics had grown stale and it was time for a new voice in the room. It will be viewed positively by year's end, IF the roster stays healthy.

Reese Kaplan said...

Well said, Mike. I pointed out another sign if a manager is how a club performs after his departure. Look to Houston and the Angels. Enough said.

bill metsiac said...

What about bouncebacks when a mgr is NOT fired? Such as when a team comes off a 74-win season to 79, 90 and 87 in the 3 successive years?

Or the 1958 Dodgers, who were next to last, but were World Champs a year later?

Or the '68 Mets, who won 73 games and followed with 100 and a WS champ in 69?

Sometimes keeping the mgr works out just fine.