The Morning Report 7.23.2015 | Terry Takes the Blame, Conforto Being Thrown to the Wolves, Can He Perform?, Mets Farm System Ranked #4


John Delcos | NY Mets Report- It was a nice gesture on the part of manager Terry Collins to accept blame for the Mets’ 4-3 loss at Washington. But, to what degree was Collins at fault? “That’s all on me. It’s not on Bobby. He’s been throwing the ball great,” Collins told reporters. “I could have let Jeurys get looser. I could have delayed the game a little bit and let him get loose.” The need to stall came about because Collins, pitching coach Dan Warthen and bullpen coach Ricky Bones – pick any of the three – didn’t get Familia up until after den Dekker reached base. Familia has to know he needs to start loosening up after the first runner got on base. It’s simple bullpen management. It has to be automatic, which makes stalling a moot issue. Stalling is playing around; what the Mets needed was a concrete strategy, which they didn’t have.

(Chris SotoLet's get this out of the way first. Yesterday's loss was BRUTAL as it was not only demoralizing, but it also accounted for a 2 game swing in NL East standing position. Instead of being 1 game back heading back to NYC, the team is now 3 games back and face Kershaw and Grienke over the next 2 days. Terry Collins rightfully wears the blame for this one. Yes, Parnell has been throwing well as of late but with as much as Collins has used Familia in 4 and 5 out situation saves, I don't know how you DON'T have Familia warming up at the beginning of the inning. These were 3 of the biggest games you've had so far this season and NOW is the time you decide to be conservative with your top weapons? That's Insane....

Bob Klapisch | Newsday- Clearly, the Mets are in a run-scoring crisis. It’s a certainty Michael Cuddyer will be placed on the disabled list as early as today. Michael Conforto, the franchise’s best hitting prospect, will be summoned from Class AA. It’s the logical move and it’ll placate the ticket buyers who are teetering toward open rebellion. But the timing of Conforto’s promotion speaks to upper management’s clumsiness and lack of vision. Conforto is being sent to war against Kershaw? Against Greinke? In his major league debut? Collins can’t possibly sacrifice a rookie like that. No kid, regardless of his genetic blessings, is ready for such a buzz saw. The smarter move would’ve been to put Cuddyer on the DL on Monday and let Conforto debut against the Nationals’ Joe Ross, himself a rookie, and Jordan

(Chris Soto: Wow...I did not think about this at all. When you look at the timing of Conforto's currently unreported promotion, this is a suicide job by them. Sandy Alderson is quickly losing the support of the "sensible" fan base due to his lack of inactivity amidst the team's overall poor play. With such a dominate pitching staff, there is clearly a window of opportunity for the Mets to break through and become successful. Even a league average offense, could result in almost 7 additional wins than what the Mets have gotten so far this season.) 

Jeff Sullivan | FanGrapsh- The question has to do with his readiness. Few people doubt that Conforto could be good, soon. More people doubt that Conforto could be good, tomorrow. He’s a college pick, a polished bat, but still, he’s not even at 50 games of experience above single-A. The Mets weren’t planning to move Conforto so fast. It’d be a rush job, compelled by the context of the standings. But that doesn’t necessarily have to be a bad thing. It’s worth wondering, then: what could the Mets expect of Conforto? I was looking at 180 debuts. These were made mostly by bat-first prospects. Those who batted at least 100 times averaged a 93 wRC+. Of the players, 37% posted a wRC+ of at least 100. Narrowing down further, 20% posted a wRC+ of at least 120. The tendency has been for the players to struggle.

(Chris Soto: You know I love my FanGraphs articles. Here's the thing with Conforto, no one is asking him to come up here and smash .350 AVG with 10 HR in his 1st week on the job. All he needs to do is be better than Cuddyer has been so far this season. Cuddyer's current line is a .250 AVG with a .683 OPS on a 23.2% K rate. That's actually a production line that I can see Conforto matching right now with some upside to push that OPS over .710 due to his ability to take walks. As for his defense, Conforto has made some good strides and I would actually dare to say that he could be an average to above average defender in LF.)

Keith Law | ESPN(Insider Post)- The Mets still have a system loaded with high-probability big leaguers, including a couple of potential stars in Conforto, Smith and shortstop Amed Rosario. The re-emergence of Gavin Cecchini as a legitimate offensive prospect gives the Mets some options for their infield going forward, especially important when the team is owned by a Scrooge. Casey Meisner, one of my two sleeper prospects for this system coming into the year, had a breakout first half for St. Lucie, and Michael Fulmer has been healthy and effective in Double-A after missing the first two weeks of the season. There's a ton of pitching in here, most of it potentially useful in trades because of the depth of the Mets' rotation, but they also have some bats coming -- five guys I'd tab as regulars or better -- to help that very sad major league offense as soon as next year.

(Chris Soto: We have been so spoiled by constantly hearing the names of Syndergaard, Wheeler, Matz, Conforto, Harvey, and deGrom that all their promotions gives you a sense that well....now the minor league system is dry. That's not the case though and the club still has a LARGE number of potential MLB contributors sprinkled throughout the system. Pretty much the only this Sandy has done really well as the General Manager is create a deep farm system that has balance from top to bottom and can supply the MLB team with 1 or 2 new MLB caliber players every single season.)


bob gregory said...

Great news about the farm system.
Now it's time to use it to acquire position players that are ready now to complement the pitching staff.

Ernest Dove said...

Im confused as to why Terry Collins, known for taking out dominating starters even with under 100 piches in a game to try to ensure victory, would also be same guy to leave in Parnell there. Dude is post TJS. He got two outs. Then back to back guys get on base. But Terry apparently thinks, "nah, he's good. Hes a veteran"...........
Not saying Familia absolutely has to be overused again, but something should have happened. (Would have helped if Mets had an actual LOOGY to use in that inning).

Anonymous said...

2 things fella's!
#1 if jerry Blevins was healthy the Mets would've won yesterday's game
#2 Conforto isn't coming till August 1st, he needs 200 at-bats above A ball

Thomas Brennan said...

To Law's point, how hot is Cecchini? Read my post at 10 AM.

Reese Kaplan said...

@Chris Soto -- the blame goes squarely on Collins, but even when he apologizes he gets it wrong. Jenrry Mejia breezed through the 7th without breaking a sweat. Why didn't you have him start the 8th considering how little he's thrown all year due to the suspension instead of bringing in the TJS-patient who STILL isn't throwing at full velocity? You could have saved Parnell's arm for the night and gone straight to Familia if Mejia got in trouble or for the 9th.

Collins doesn't ever try new things. He has it in his mind Mejia pitches the 7th, Parnell the 8th and Familia the 9th. Would that it were that simple...every day is a new day and every situation is different. You can't force your narrow mindedness and expect it to work.

Regarding Conforto, agreed with the note about Greinke and Kershaw. Once again the team does its best to sabotage a young player, though for a change this time it's on Alderson and not Collins. I guess when he does play he'll bat 8th with the pitcher behind him. That will be on Collins. It's not like there isn't a bevy of inferior hitters who deserve the 8th spot...

Thomas Brennan said...

Reese, great point on Mejia. Run him out again for the 8th. If he struggles, then call in Parnell.

Michael S. said...

The fact that our farm system is STILL a top 5 in MLB (by KLaw, a man who is not won over easily) cannot be overstated. The presence of top pitching prospects made the Mets an easy choice for a top ranking. Now that they've graduated their studs (save Fulmer) and are still gaining top recognition based now on position prospects means that these players have significant value - TO US.

The chorus calling for the trading of these players needs to quiet down a bit. Yes, we're starving for a winner and find ourselves in a pennant race even though we're devoid of offense. Adding hitters CAN help that effort. However, the available hitters are nothing to write home about. Are fans so short-sighted that they'd happily trade 6 years (and possibly more) of multiple major league hitters for an outside shot THIS year? There are no difference makers out there. Parra and Zobrist aren't making this a WS championship team. Even Justin Upton wouldn't - his numbers are strikingly similar to this year's Duda. Does that sound like a winning combination?

Dealing our prizes now for mediocre talent goes against everything that's been built the last few years. Trade Nimmo, Cecchini, Fulmet, et. al. for role players will render the last few painful seasons MEANINGLESS. I can't believe my eyes when I read intelligent fans so ready to give up highly regarded players for pennies on the dollar. With the talent available, if this is a seller's market we should not be buying.

If names like Braun, Tulowitzki, and Votto (to name a few) become available, THEN we should be discussing the merits of trading our top young talent. Until then, allow them to continue to grow.

Hobie said...

Hindsight is so acute (mine is 20/10).

Parnell was throwing 96-97 (higher each game)
den Dekker's hit was flukey
WP was a killer

Take him out? Thought about it, but 50/50 at the time. Now, of course, I'm sure.

Lew Rhodes said...

Parnell looked AWESOME live on Tuesday night - he was pitching well Wed too - that was one of those things that happen - he didn't really get hit hard.

If Collins wants to take fault - how about this - why did Familia pitch with a 5 run lead on Tuesday? Clearly no one wanted Familia to throw 2 innings yesterday - especially after throwing a useless inning on Tuesday - if he didn't pitch on Tuesday, I bet he is up at the start of the 8th.

This team is flawed, yes, but Collins is still an idiot

Lew Rhodes said...

I also agree 100% with Reese (which means we must be right!)

Why take Meija out? He dominated on Tuesday and looked great on Wed in the 7th

bob gregory said...

Many seasons players similar to the ones you mention suddenly get traded with similar or less speculation Braun, Tulo, etc have received so far.

Ernest Dove said...

I hear what ur sayin Michael S. But what are Mets building for?
I thinks its wonderful that they still have a top 5 farm system, but I'd rather they had a top 5 mlb team.
Are u expecting Harvey degrom wheeler matz and Thor to all stay healthy, all be consistently dominate every night. Are you expecting Nimmo, conforto, cecchini, Fulmer and company to all show up at citi field and take turns competing for rookie of the year honors?
Injuries happen. Stuff happens. For all we know the Nats, had they not shut down Strasburg that year, would have won a world srriesr title.
We can expect the Mets to simply load up on a 25man homegrown team, win 90-100 games a year, and also expect current ownership to simoly start handing out $100+mil contracts to everybody.
You just never know. Get who ya can. Try to make the playoffs. Play winning baseball NOW........ "you play to win the games. Hello"

bob gregory said...

Well said Ernest.
Now has to start sometime.
Waiting for what may or may not come will certainly result in losing some of what you have now.

Michael S. said...

The players that are being discussed are not going to make the Mets contenders. Doing something for the sake of doing it is foolish.

I don't expect our young players to battle for ROY honors, I expect them to become MLB regulars who produce what's expected of them. We've seen enough 'go for it' trades over the last two decades that did nothing for the team.

Sorry Ernest, but adding 'who you can' is a foolish way to manage your assets.

I do expect the pitching to hold up, that's always been the point - build the foundation of a long-term successful team on them. That's what we've committed to. Now, whT you're essentially saying is 'it's this year or never'. If this is the best it's going to get and this is what we've been waiting for we might as well fold now.

Bring me a difference maker and then we can deal our prospects. Having a top5 farm CAN and WILL translate into a top5 MLB team if the assets are handled properly. Buying band aids in a vain attempt to eek into the playoffs THIS year is exactly what we've talked about not wanting for this organization and we've railed against the lack of foresight by other GMs as well as our previous ones. Now we want to get back on that carousel....really?

The frustration and lack of patience is making everyone nutty. There's nothing wrong with making deals and trading prospects for MLB talent, but they have to be the RIGHT deals. How can you honestly feel that dealing 2-3 of the top prospects of a top system for a free agent utility player and a glorified 4th OF is good management?

Michael S. said...

I get it...we're all starving and we've been thrown a few crackers so we're desperate for a few more. Bad decisions are made from these emotions. Dumping talent to satisfy an immediate desire is what will bring us more losing.

What happens when we dump our assets for mediocre talent and still don't make the playoffs? What do we do in the offseason? Who or what can we trade then? Savvy GMs take advantage of the line of thinking you're espousing.

'NOW' can start next season. Were you expecting to go from bottom feeder to champion in a year?

Michael S. said...

Then if they're available, go for it. For now we've been discussing the names that have been out there.

With Wright out of the picture we're going to need 2 run producing bats, if not star hitters. Our assets should be used on those types of deals or not at all.

Colorado wants Wheeler + for Tulo? Do it. Milwaukee wants Fulmer + for Braun? Do it. Votto costs Smith and others? You see the pattern. Zobrist costs Cecchini and Fulmer? The A's can pound sand. David Price was cheaper.

Ernest Dove said...

......again. ......michael....buddy.....ur assuminy that ALL these prospects will meet expectations.
Maybe guys like Parra and Zobrist in ur eyes are mediocre. Maybe Nimmo cecchini and Fulmer will all be mediocre major leaguers (if they ever even make it that far).
Pirates traded away Dilson Herrera and Vic black to acquire a 36yrd old rental and back up catcher.
We feel that Dilson can be a 10+yr multi all star. They were hoping to stay over .500 FINALLY and make the playoffs. Good for pirates. Good for their fans. They deserved it regardless of outcome.

Anonymous said...

@ Michael S

Could not agree more with your comments and assessment. as difficult as it is to watch this lineup struggle offensively I would hate to give young controllable talent away for short term mediocrity e.g. Venable or even parra who I have always liked. i would rather see Nimmo or Conforto- they are both 22 - it's not like they are 18 or 19. Maybe in the offseason we structure a deal around some of our pieces but not for a short term rental that won't even return a draft pick if the sign elsewhere.

Ernest Dove said...

Wait wait wait.....hold up.......did the As trade scott kazmir to the Astros for their 19th and 22nd best prospect !?!?!?!?!?
I take everything back lol. Nimmo Cecchini and Fulmer are waaaaay to e
Good for A's to have.

Michael S. said...

Ernest...buddy...you're missing the big picture. It's poor asset management. Maybe the kids bust but only a short-sighted fool would sell our top assets for complimentary pieces when we don't even have primary pieces.

I'm glad Frank Cashen didn't subscribe to your thinking and I hope Sandy continues the fortitude he's shown.

As far as the Pirates, you're making my point for me. Short-sighted short term deal that got them nothing and subtracted from their asset pool. Sandy exploits those opportunities and gaffes, here's hoping he doesn't wind up on the other side of one. Gord Ash was well-known and respected for holding onto his prospects...then he got antsy and moved some top talents for an aging knuckleballer coming off a fluke Cy Young all in the name of going for it. More times than not the impatient move fails.

Michael S. said...

Bravo...some sanity.

Ernest Dove said...

I would now like to offer Whalen and Mazzilli to the A's for Zobrist.
Then immediately promote my man Jeff McNeil to Bingo ;)

Michael S. said...

Thank you anon. I want to win as much as anyone but the whole point has been to build a sustainable model for success. All around baseball the Mets are viewed as not only a team on the rise but also as one that can be good for a long time to come. We haven't been this well-positioned for a long, long time and tossing that away for a 'shot' at the playoffs would be disastrous. I'd rather take my medicine for just a bit longer to ensure we're in the conversation as a model franchise (sans ownership) for years to come. If we start emptying our war chest at the wrong time, this will be yet another era of "what could've been"

Dallas said...

I also completely agree with Michael S. Media is driving people into illogical frenzies. We dont want a Kazmir(not todays trade, the first one) repeat.

On a different note, how long do they let Colon struggle before doing something? I know he is a mentor to the young guys but he has been really bad over his last 10 starts. How many more starts does he get if he continues to be bad? He and the Torrii seem to be the only chinks in the Mets pitching armor.

Michael S. said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Michael S. said...

Thank you Dallas

bob gregory said...

I think we and Ernst are saying the same thing.
Go get Difference makers for today and tomorrow.
No more excuses.
Alderson needs to use his self proclaimed brilliance and turn the Mets franchise around similar to Keith Hernandez and Gary Carter.

bob gregory said...

Kazmir traded. Ramirez traded.
Come on Alderson.
Get your targets.
Gomez. Braun. Tulowitzki. Find a couple of cogs for the Mets offense.
Get them in the lineup.

Gary Seagren said...

Michael S. spot on with your comments and another thing about this year. With Harvey, Degrom and Thor on innings limits we can't give up what has taken years to build for a quick fix when if I'm not mistaken our big 3 will only make it till mid sept. If anyone has more imput on this situation please reply.

Steve from Norfolk said...


Supposedly the plan for the starters' innings is to use Gee/Matz(when healed)/C. Torres/Fulmer/???? to make a few spot starts to let The Three skip one or two starts each. That would go a long way toward making them last through any postseason games we might encounter. Also, you bring Gee back up on Aug.31 (and Matz, if healthy), and you've got some extra starters for long relief or injury coverage. I just hope we get Wright back before then, although if there's any chance of any postseason games, I would bet he gets activated on 8/31, healthy or not, just so he's postseason eligible.

Mack Ade said...

Steve - Gary

David will try to come back.

I don't know how successful he will be but he will try.

Also... lots of Oakland top scouts at the B-Mets game today

Mack's Mets © 2012